Average to Savage
Average to Savage

Episode · 8 months ago

Jeff Lipson | Average to Savage EP167

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

This is the one hundred and sixty-seventh episode of the Average to Savage podcast featuring the chief strategy officer of MetaFans Jeff Lipson. Paul Guarino talked with Jeff Lipson discussing his career including working at Vayner Media, getting into NFTs, and diving into web 3 with MetaFans NFT.  

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https://twitter.com/metafansnft 

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This podcast interview with Jeff Lipson was originally recorded on March 3, 2021

This is the average to savage podcast with Paul Greno everyone in anyone, athletes, celebs and much more. This episode is powered by Meta fans. Meta fans is an NFT project for all the sports lovers. You know why you should get Meta fans? You know why you should get it because it got the ultimate utility. What is utility? It's the perks of having the NFT. You thought about getting nft right, probably. So this is the one to get for sports lovers. You know why? Because free ticket GIVEAWAYS, free in real life events. They're going to be doing cash prizes for fantasy sports and all that good stuff, pickums and all that. You love fantasy sports. I know it, right. Yeah, okay. So then you're going to go to the website metafanscom. You're going to mint it for point zero eight. You're going to buy it. That's what mint means. You're going to buy it. Right. Points are right around two hundred and fifty, right to D and fifty. You get all that. They just had a super bowl party at Wrigley field. They rented out the whole stadium. It was nuts. It's crazy, it's lit. They're doing all these good things. I think personally, it's one of the most slept on projects. It's all about the perks. You guys think it's just a jpeg. This is what you get when you get a jpeg. You know. Go check it out. Metafanscom, M E T A F A N Scom. Metafanscom. Go Mint it. If you mint one, tag me in it at PCG seven, tag me average, tag me PG sports, whatever. Tag Meta fans, obviously, tag me to and see what happens. Maybe you'll get another maybe you get another perk. Who knows? Never O check it out, Meta fans. So up, everybody. On back for another episode of the average savage podcast. Or special guest today is Jeff Lipson. Jeff, how's it going? It is going great. Paul. How you doing? Man, thank you for having me on. This is I've been looking forward to this for weeks. I really appreciate it. Many for sure. That's that's funny. So just just give me a little bit a brief background round yourself. I know you worked at Vander media and things like that. Yeah, so my career is it's it's been kind of can say it's been all over the place. I feel like I've gotten to do a lot of different things over the course of my career. I got to manage multi billion dollar bio pharmaceutical supply chains. I got to help manage, you know, tens of millions of dollars of media working with fortune five hundred companies. I got to to sell in media plans, I got to put together change management strategies and help out call centers, I got to build really cool tech products and mobile APPS and web applications for fortune five hundreds and and then, you know, obviously now in my career I'm focused in the web, three technology and NFT space. But really like, at a high level, it's a combination of management consulting experience. That got more deep on the product side of things and and then the marketing strategy side of side of things when I spent my years over at Vaner media, working under Gary, specifically on the media side of things and just seeing what that whole world was about. And that was actually that was back in you know, I probably started there around two thousand and seventeen and that was the first time that I heard about Crypto punks and people started talking about nfts. But obviously it didn't get mainstream at all until really the last year, year and a half or so, but that's kind of the journey that I've taken. And then I over the you know, I've known about Crypto and and, you know, dabbled and played around with it. Probably first time I started talking about Bitcoin was in two thousand and thirteen. I remember I was that was abroad and I was with my friends in the Netherlands and we were looking at this massive spike and in bitcoin prices at the time and we were kind of laughing about it and that was sort of my first foray and research into the CRYPTO space. And then on...

...the NFT side of things, it really started probably about year and a half, two years ago, starting to look into it more naturally, you know, given the the manor connections, I have a lot of a lot of friends and former colleagues that are involved in the space, so I always kind of stayed pretty pretty connected and just seeing it evolve over time. But then really started to play around myself, you know, probably around a year and a half ago in terms of opening up, while it's playing around a discords, getting more involved in twitter and starting to think more deeply, read more deeply and be strategizing in my own head about where the web three space is going. Yeah, ever, sure, that's awesome. All right, before I ask them that, quod, because you just turn the discord off. So the that is yes, I absolutely can do that. See, I'm always I'm always around, I'm always doing I was like, I was like you probably doesn't even notice it because he hears it all the time. Literally, it's like white holes for me. All right, we should be we should be good. Now. If that's not like authentic, I mean I know that's that's why I was money too. I was like, yeah, this kind of going to be good, because it's gonna be like Yo, he's actually it just keeps on peeple. I'm always in it. I'm literally in between managing team, putting out fires in the discord, partner steps and then jump onto the podcast with my man Paul. So that's that's what life is like. It's it's fast and it's fun in this world right now. Yeah, no, no, for sure. So I know you're the chief strategist for Meta fans, but just tell me a little bit about how you got into NFT's on the first one. I know you just mentioned you knew about it, but like what are in? Like, how'd you got into it? And tell me what your first nft purchase those yeah, so my first nft purchase was a crypto corgy and it was literally it was like hadn't done that much research, but it was very, very cheap, and I so like, as someone who comes from a product background, I am very, very much always thinking about in tune with the user experience, friction within an experience and what that what that looks like, because for me, when I'm building products, I'm always thinking about how do I remove friction from the process? How do I create the best user experience possible? And in order to create the best user experience you need to be deeply invested in understand the experience as it is today for people to be able to then create something better. So I was starting to get, you know, more deep on twitter and very tuned in, getting my ear to the ground in the whole twitter nft world, or nft twitter world, excuse me, and I just saw some posts, you know, where it's like hey, here like cheap projects that might have been around a while. That could be like good long term holds that if you want to just like start getting involved in stuff, and I want to say that that was in maybe, like I want to say that that was like summer of two thousand and twenty. One was probably like the first purchase that I made, even though I'd kind of just been listening and looking and playing around for a long time, because I didn't for me, it's like, no, I wasn't trying to get into so much of this like quick flip situation. For me, I was always more interested in it all from a technology perspective and what was going to be built from it and how people were adopting blockchain technology. So that was my first purchase and the experience was, you know, eye opening from, you know, making sure that I had the right wall. Let's set up, you know was it was. Was I going to have the coin base wall it set up? was going to be a Meta Mask Wall? At which one did I like more? Why? We're their differences. What did the Wallet Connect Aspect feel like? How did the gas fees aspect of things feel like? Getting to understand why gas fees were, you know, different during certain times of day, during a big mint that was happening or not. So just going...

...through that process and then actually minting something and then seeing where it goes and really analyzing the ether scan and understanding how these transactions are occurring. So that was my first that was my first purchase and it was I that was like that first moment where I was like, this is really cool. This is also very, very like the nascent right like there's a lot that still needs to be done to be able to get this industry actually adopted, because the truth is that right now, like, yes, there's a little adoption and yes, the stuff's going mainstream to a degree. Obviously you see like what cryptopunks and board apes and more recently, like doodles has been doing, and world of women and some of those projects. But for the most part the NFT world is it is an echo chamber of like a couple hundred thousand people that are all buying and selling from each other, and I feel like we're hitting this sort of plateauish point right now from an adoption perspective, because it's just too hard for people. This is just it's just so different, Ye know for sure. That's why I'm mensured to see when coin base releases their platform to like buy and so on, trade, whatever you want to say, to see, I think I think that's going to get more people in because they know, because people already know about coin based from just like trading crypto and stuff like that. So I'll be interesting to see. Yeah, and then tell me how you got how you got involved in Meta fans and then is it and then actually in going from quote unquote, corporate world, so now those web three world. Is that like crazy to you, that that's this is your full time job? Right? It is? No, it's my full will. You know, I don't want to call it a nine hundred and twenty five because it's not. It's it's it's entrepreneurial, it's fun, it's dynamic. But yes, this is my full time job. Now I left my management consulting Gig, which I loved, by the way, and you know, I was super happy there and loved the people that I worked with and it would like it was a very good career that I was carving out for myself there and was able to work with cool clients and build the cool shit. But at the end of the day it wasn't necessarily like my passion right like, and I'd still at that point in my life, never got to really work at the thing that I was really passionate about and I went, but I wasn't looking to leave. I was interested in the web three space, obviously, and I I just attended and FT Bosle and, you know, was looking for more things to be able to go do, to continue to involve myself in the space. And it's a it's an interesting story. So, so, basically, my brother in law's best friend is Anthony Rizzo and I have gotten to know him, you know, over the last couple of years, and so we were all together and he was telling me about this project called Meta fans that he knows the the founder of and that it's really legit and he's minting them and to check it out, and so I did and I actually so I've minted one. When we were all there with each other, we were all kind of Mento, I minted one and I minted one of a we call our owners box guests, which is one of the eighteen out of Tenzero, super rare of our tenzero and FT collection. And so I think that drove me to just naturally have a little more skin in the game and want to get involved in the community and I just started naturally talking with with Jordan. You know one of our founders and giving just some of my insight from my professional experience of just both from kind of like a product perspective and a community building perspective and a market getting strategy perspective and kind of leaning that into the NFT and web three world.

And and one thing led to another and was not looking necessarily looking forward, and one thing led to another and it was just that the fit was right. And and so I just said, you know what, like let's let's do this, let's do this the other, like, I believe in what you're building here and I think that there's there's ways that I will be able to drive this ship and help lead and help really think for like, think through for us what we're going to be building down the road and how we're going to continue to build out our company in our project today. And I just said, Yolo Man, I said yellow, let's go for it. I mean he like you really do only live once and it sometimes these opportunities just kind of fall on your lap and you know, I feel very blessed and it's been an incredible decision. You know, working with awesome people and just being in such a dynamic and fun space yeah, no, definitely not. I like that, the Yolo approach, because like even, like as I get older, even though I think I'm still young, like I like that's how I feel too. I'm just like all right, like I've just got to start doing this, like start doing stuff, like saying yes, like, you know, saying no to other things and saying yes to some new things. And those listeners that don't know Anthony Rosseau's allstar world series champion baseball player, if you guys don't know that. And Yeah, and then tell me, just tell me a little bit, like what Meta fans is. So Meta fans is, you know, and in its current evolution, Meta fans is an NFT project with a tenzero unit and FT collection. And essentially we're very, very utility, value driven, in real life experience driven projects. So by purchasing a METAPAN, you're essentially getting access into our clubhouse, and our clubhouse is kind of where all of our perks and our access and our experience it we we believe in building community, right. So the kind of the start and the precipice of all this from Jordan's perspective was, you know, sports and entertainment. You know, from a young age is how community start to form. A lot of community start to form right you start to form communities around sports that you're playing with other people and music than getting along with other folks, and you build these these villages of people around some of those things. And how do we now do that in a digital world, in the direction that we're moving? And so that was kind of the the the crux behind why do we want to start Meta fans? And so for us, our for kind of core pillars are around community, building, real community. I know that word gets thrown out around a lot, but I mean like really like building a village of people that really care for one another, that are developing real relationships with the each other, which means also getting to see and and understand and meet one another in real life in addition to creating those experiences and that that connection in a digital way. So that's number one, like really building community village takes care of the village. Second pieces around empowerment. And how do we empower people that become Meta fans, both from the experiences and the access that we provide, but also by giving them the kind of the educational and networking experiences to keep to keep growing and keep learning. We have very much kind of over indexed on the first time nft buyer and even first time wallet openers and even some of them first time crypto purchasers. So back to that adoption point I made earlier, I actually am very proud of the fact that I think we very much are driving adoption outside of that echo chamber because of the the types of folks that were bringing into Meta fans, and so we're trying to give them those experiences...

...that they might not have otherwise ever been able to have, right with their loved ones and with their friends, like going into a suite or going to have these club these you know, club suite seats, any of that kind of stuff, and then, from an educational perspective, giving them a safe space to be able to keep growing and learning within NFTS and web three in Blockchain, when they otherwise might not have because there's there's still this lack of trust, understandably, in this space, for a lot of these people to feel comfortable enough to jump in. And then the two other pieces are round charity. We've given it a ton of a ton of money and donate a ton of money back to charity, probably coming up close to a hundred thousand dollars at this point. And then around innovation, and that goes back to kind of, you know, my my background around technology and product and how am I thinking six months, twelve months, twenty four months, five years down the line with where this technology is going and how we very much play on being a part of it for the long hall? Yeah, yeah, no, for sure, and I think that's one thing that tractor to you guys a well one. It's sports. Sports really did, and I haven't seen that many sports pro and of teas in general. And then I think, I think your utility is way easier to understand and a lot of people's, because sometimes it's just like they're like Oh, yeah, are drops and bulb on. I'm just like all right, cool, like yeah, I guess. And then but yours obviously like real life events and like actual like you know, games and things like that that people actually already know. It's like almost bringing web to and web three together. I guess it's exactly what it is. And we're we're like not, we very much embrace and do are not ashamed of the fact that that's the case. Right, like we're not purely digital and I think that's okay. I think we're we're trying to bridge the gap right. You can't just jump web too to web three with no bridge in the middle, and I think that we're trying to be some of that bridge for people and, like you said, yeah, like we're giving like very tangible value and utility back. I mean we have a we have a racehouse suite for the fone my me Grand Prix that's coming up in May. There's going to be a handful of Lucky Meta fans that get to go to that. That's going to be probably the hottest ticket in America. We just threw a super bowl party at Wrigley field with two hundred, two hundred Meta fans. They're exclusive only to Meta fans, with open bar and watching the game and DJ afterparty and food and all that good stuff. All expenses paid in that regard and we have people coming in from all over the US. We give out tickets to games that we have access to with premium seats on a regular basis. Baseball, hockey, basketball, you name it. We have Lallapalooza coming up where we think we have around thirty tickets a day with premium access to the IP areas. There's going to be Meta fans are going to be able to go to that. You know, we have our and then, outside of just tickets and stuff, we also have our, you know, free to enter cash prize games. We've been doing squares pools and NBA pick thems. We just launched our golf pick them. We're going to have our Meta fans march mayhem bracket challenge coming out all that stuff. You know, people are on a weekly basis. We're sending eath to people's wallets that win, depending on the size of the game, anywhere from two hundred fifty to this this March mayhem stuff is going to be up to, you know, north of three thousand dollars for first place winners. So just giving like that environment where people are having fun, they're communicating with each other, they're getting to know one another, they're learning about the space, they're playing in these fun games that, you know, keep them engaged and involved in the web three space base. They're winning tickets to stuff there, they're meeting people from different parts of the US at these events that they're that they're that they're going to. And then, on top of that, we also actually have a discount of ticketing platform that people can go to by connecting their wall approving they have a metapan. We basically turned off all the fees. If you're comparing us to like a stub harbor seekkeek, you're probably saving a ton of money by being a Meta Fan and being able to go to that site. So like very, very tangible utility. And there's that's just the beginning, right, like that's just kind of this first playbook, as...

I sort of call it, of what we've been running with, and there's a lot more to come. I've been going through a lot of hiring and building out a much bigger longer term strategy for what we're going to continue to build. So that's what we've been doing so far. Yeah, no, definitely too, and I think, I think not not being biased, but I think you guys are one of the most slept on product projects that not be sold out. Yeah, which is crazy to me, just like all those things that you just mentioned, like people should just be going to moment. I know, I know, and at the end of the way I see it, first of all, I appreciate it because you know, obviously I feel the same way you know represent Meta fans, but it's it's just there's so much I don't take it personally because there's just there's so much noise out there and and and there's so many projects coming and going and there's so many minting, new ones minting every day, that most people at come into the space are looking to do it to make money, right, like they're doing it to treat an nft like a stock and try to flip it for money. And when you come in and look at a project and you're like it's been minting for, you know, a handful of months now and the floor price is more or less what the mint price is, you know, why would I invest in that? And if you're not actually doing more research and jumping into what we're doing and and who we are and the people behind the project, then you'll never see it. And so it's it's about how we continue to amplify our message to be able to let people realize what kind of value is out there for them. But I don't I don't blame people that are jumping in. You know, I get it. I understand why it's happening. What I do think is interesting is, you know, how I'm curious how long it's going to take to sort of reframe the narrative and the conversation around around NFT and web three projects companies and how we judge failure and success. Because if I told you that I just started a retail brand, like an ecommerce retail brand, three months ago and I haven't sold out of all of my inventory that I bought up yet, and then you told me, well, Jeff, probably time to pack it in, it's been a failure. Can you imagine if that's the business advice that people were giving to one another in a normal business world? That's whack as that's whack as shit. So I understand why there's a different mentality and from a consumer behavior perspective in the NFT and web three world, but I don't think it's going to last and it shouldn't last, because those aren't normal business principles. Those are just unicorns, you know, that pop up and things like that happened too. So I'm you know, I'm really not concerned and and worried and I'm I'm thinking much, much longer to all right, and Meta fans, you also have ambassadors like Dan Marino and Anthony Rosol so how did them to a few other ones to yeah, okay, wow, I don't want to forget people. I feel like I should pull up the website. So we're we're a well connected group and when Jordan was starting to put this together, really was you know, he started talking to day and he started talking to Anthony and some of the people around there, and we're also very involved, or Jordan's very involved, with another sports agency and so we've got someone really close to us is name Sammy, who represents all those people and we just are very well, you know, kind of good friends with those folks and well connected with them. And so when they when, you know, Jordan was talking to them about what he was thinking about doing, there was just a and a level of interest and just trust in in believing in Jordan and and and what he wants to build and do and that comfort level of putting their name behind the brand. So there's you can check out the metafans websites...

...www dot metafanscom. But you'll see as you scroll down on the page, there's Dan Marino, there's Anthony Rizzo, there's ricky most start from the from the niners. There's Josh Hammonds, there's brave and Roy, there's joy Taylor. I'm not sure if I'm forgetting anyone else. That boom. All right, deler, you said, just do it. And J yeah, and Jat. How can I forget the dolphins, ledgendcase and Taylor? Yeah, so JT's another one. So we've got all those folks supporting us. We've had other athletes that have also just bought into the project that have gotten connected to us, either just by finding out about us on socials or being, you know, friends of Anthony's or whoever it may be, that have gotten involved and actually purchased Meta fans on their own. So they've been awesome, very supportive and we're very lucky to kind of have have those types of names to give credibility to what we're trying to build. Yeah, well, we'll. Jeff, I don't know if you know this, but a lot of NFT projects they have never run a business before. So I think that's one problem in the NFT space now. And even even so, obviously everyone's goal to sell out, but I've also seen project really sell out and then they have no idea what to do after that. So it's like a catch twenty two and I think, like you said, I think a lot of things are changing. Like only been deep into this since like November, October, so I already seen changes from those couple months of even people flipping stuff and versus holding stuff, and projects flopping versus not flopping and things like that. So it is even a perfect example is just anonymous thing. Like I thought it was so weird when I got on twitter spaces and people were not. I was like why you guys anonymous, like I don't understand, and then yeah, so that's like okay, yeah, yeah, so that's like coming out more so now, even now. So is like people aren't backing projects that people are anonymous, or they are. I think they are anonymous. Yeah, I mean like it was something that started in the beginning, but grand scheme of things, like why would you? I mean, could you imagine someone like walking up on shark tank and like and like where it says like a name? It's just question marks and they're wearing a mask and they're like, Mark Cuban, I want fifteen million dollars for a ten percent stake in my business, but you can't know who I am. I mean it's there's there's certain things that should change and evolve with like with web three and the direction that we're moving from a technology perspective, but that's not one of them and I think that it's you know, it was, it was. It was built into the technology, not necessarily purposefully, but just because of that's just how it works and I think that's been leaned into a lot. But at the end of the day, like if I'm trying to build a business, how can I not know who my customers are? I have to to be able to build a better product, to be able to geographically understand, like where I should be investing, you know, our resources to make the experience better. Where should we go have events? Where should we be trying to message people? WHERE SHOULD WE BE? If we don't have any information, then how are we supposed to to be able to build and be better? It's it's that is a very interesting dynamic. That is, you know, an unprecedented issue that people haven't had to deal with in the traditional business sense before that, you know, we're now trying to tackle in this new world that we're navigating. Yeah, and even going back to like what you're saying about if you created a retail ecommercial or and you didn't sell out everything three months. That's like totally true too, because now, even like it's sometimes it's even better that you are still minting, because you could just go on the twitter spaces and be like, Yo, I'm still minting this project, because everyone's always asking like when's mint yeah, like I got it right now. Like even my project, like my mini project, I only...

...had twelve n of tease but I only sold one and I didn't sell out until almost like, I don't know, nine months later, because I didn't know what the Hell I was doing. Yeah, and then I figure it all out and then people wanted to buy it. So it just like, like you said, I think it's just a matter of time of more people getting like, first of all, the the stab back in November. I don't know if they updated. It's only like I think it was like three or four percent of Americans own and ND OFC so that was like yeah, Super Logan and actually shock it's even that high. Yeah, well, who you are then? Americans? Yeah, because people, it was but people got multiple wallets. So who knows, like how many that you know what I mean. I mean honestly, I feel like if I would have Gett it, I would have said like half a percent. That's crazy. Seriously, I mean your four percent. That's a lot of people, or could have been in the world. I'm not I can't remember. It was just it was still a low number. So yeah, there's it was. But but what about? What about going back? What advice would you give to people working on NFC projects? So number one, I think that it's like don't, don't do it unless you're interested in being in the web three space for the long haul, because if you're not, then if you're only interested in being around for two years, you're not. You might make your money, but you're not going to be doing right by the people that are buying your things. So unless you really have a vision that that is going to live past this first wave of NFT's right and and what how we think about them and how we buy and sell them and all that, then I don't think if you're not being thoughtful enough, then I think take a step back and be more thoughtful. So I think that's number one. Number two is really invest in content and marketing and understanding what resonates with people and really double down on content before, well particularly before you go launch and mint. But, more importantly than that, make sure that you're actually being run by from an operational perspective, like, going back to your point, that people that understand how to run a business, because, exactly what you said, the number of projects that sell out, that have a road map worst, worst word in the world, and and and are like, promise you this and promise you that, and we're going to build this and we're going to build that, and we're literally talking about like a twenty two year old who has literally never run a business before. Don't know what recruiting is, doesn't know what HR is, doesn't know what operations is, is never run a content calendar as never built product before, is never managed engineers, has never done any of this. You need to make sure that you have the operational excellence in place to be able to actually execute after your mint is over and once you you need to start actually working on things. The other thing is is that I find a lot of projects like don't actually start working on things until after they're done minting. Yeah, I for me, it's like treat this like a business, if you can, like have some of that money available to you before you mint. If you really think that you're doing something like either come to the table with money or try to raise a little bit of money, because if you're only starting to work on things after your mint is over because you've raised funds, it's it takes a long time to build stuff that matters. So those would be, I think, some of my biggest my biggest things, and that and that could and also that community, more than anything, is the most important thing, like and and that again like the word. When I say that, I mean, like this is something...

...that ties back to before web three and it goes back to web to and it goes back before that. And it basically means having, having a group of people. It's brand. It's brand. That's what it is. You're developing a brand and your divent. You're developing brand loyalty. We call that community now and and obviously there's other elements to community as well around, like, you know, the relationships and the bonds that are being made between people and how they interact with each other. But that community that you're building is ultimately a brand loyal one. And how do you do that? And you can only do that through trust, through authenticity, through, you know, being true to your word, by executing, by doing all that stuff. So that's those are some of the things. Yeah, definitely, like even when I was first started, and I did mind, luggage said unlock up plug. I just threw mine up on opens and it just said like unlockable. So I was like all right, like everyone, like, I didn't even know what utility was at that point. I was like, all right, everyone's going to get like free merch. And now it's funny that everyone like Merch is like a huge thing, because I'm like, I'm like, okay, like that. You guys are impressed by Merch. Okay, I could do that either. Yeah, so I'm like, okay, don't think weird. It's weird to me just like seeing all this stuff and it's like bet, it's almost like not backwards, but it's like old school to me. But it's like I don't, I just don't understand sometimes the appeal like why it's getting people excited, like going to games and events. That to me, that's more exciting, like things like that. Then like apparel, and I just don't. I mean I think it's cool, but I just don't. I just don't grasp it on terms of coming from web to in. The people weren't aren't thrilled that much about that stuff. I know. I I don't know if it's just if I think that's going to change, and I don't know if it's because the expectations are so low for all these projects. Like I don't think Merch, like I feel like merch. That's that's that's low. That's not it's anything people stakes. Yeah, that's right. Like, so I don't understand the merch drop. I don't get it either. No, I really don't. I mean merch can be fresh and cool. Yeah, but yeah, I don't understand why by a projects floor would rise by half an eath after a merge drop. All right, I just think that part of it is like this word project. I really really, I really hope we're starting to see like vernacular start to change in the space a little bit, which I think is good. Like the word white list is now starting to change and the Word Road Map is starting to change more and all that stuff, and I really hope that we start to move away from the word project because I think that it does one of two things. Usually one is it either it kind of it allows the bar to be set lower with the way that we think about the word, where people are like almost allowed to skate by because it's just a project, right, just a project. So like what they expectations don't need to be that high. And then the other thing that it does is it delegitimizes things that are much bigger than projects. Like I hate calling ourselves a project because I'm running a fucking business here and and a technology company that is being a lot more thoughtful than a project. And so I hope that we move away from that word because I think that by calling it project, people are like excited about merge drops because look, this project at a merge drop. But that's cool. But if I told you that, like, you know, Toyota was doing a merge drop, do you think that their stock would rise fifty percent in value? And I just don't see why we're treating these these companies differently, because all they are, end of the day, our LC's, most of them. Yeah, yeah, I know for sure. I don't. I don't know. We'll see what happened. By the way, it's also, I hope I you. It's what I will say, and it's like I've...

...been ranting a little bit. What I will say is that I'm I love the creativity that all of this is sparked and the opportunity that this has provided for so many people to become entrepreneurial and to do things that they've never done before and to create opportunities for themselves. And so, even though there is all this noise, like, I think it's amazing and I think it's a natural state of evolution for for just for humans and all of us, and I'm all about all of it. I do think that there's going to be things that are going to change and I think there's some things that should change, but I'm all love and support for everyone going and get, you know, get there, as long as they're doing it the right way and they're being ethical about it and they're being thoughtful about it. I'm all for everyone going after it and taking advantage of this amazing opportunity to get more experience and be entrepreneurial and go secure the bag and all that stuff. Yeah, no, definitely same likewise with me, like, I'm not I'm not like mad at it, I'm just like kind of confused and trying to figure it out and like see where it goes. Are you ready for some fun questions? All right, firem away. All right, what's your since you're a Metapan? Where's a where's a place that like? Where's a game or a venue that you haven't been there? You want to go to that? I haven't been that I want to go to. That's a good one. So I mean, I guess I technically have been there now, but I'm excited to. But I haven't been to a game. I've just been to the venue at Wrigley so I'm excited to go to a Chicago cubs game at Wrigley Field. That's pretty iconic. I'm not like a I'm not base I love all sports. Baseball's not my favorite sport, but you know, I went to school in the Boston area. You know I've been to fenway and I the magic of that park and so I can only imagine what it's there epically too. So what are your favorite teams? I'm a die hard. So I grew up in south Florida and I also grew up being a hockey player. So I am a die, Die, Die Hard Florida Panthers Fan, and so that's actually super exciting for me this season because we're we're actually finally, like really fucking good. And it in like twenty years of of being a fan of a team that was always so bad and I've just stuck through it so hardcore. Like I remember when I was in like Middle School, I had never seen us make the playoffs and we were finally having like a half decent season and it came down to the eighty two game of the season and I believe that we won our game, we got to ninety three points and then Montreal also either won their game or like went into overtime and we ended up tying them and we lost out on the eighth and final playoff spot by tiebreaker and I was devastated. I was crying. I was like it would mess up. So yeah, a die hard Flore to panthers fan, that's number one by far. And then I'm you know, I'm a homer, so I love the heat and the dolphins and I even support the Marlins, even through all the craziness that they have put this south Florida community through. And then I grew to love when I was living up in Manhattan, I grew to love NYCFC. So that was that was a lot of fun going to games at Yankee Stadium. Yeah, that's cool. I'm a Yankees Fan and a dolphins fan, or my two main sports, I'd say, and then the nets and then for hockey, I actually do with the the panthers or the Maple leafs. So wait, how? How would how did we get to the dolphins? I got relative in Florida, so I believe. I think my aunt sent me a I don't know how it happened because I...

...remember I used to wear like bills and patriots stuff, but then maybe I think I probably change because all my life I always been like going against people. So I'm like I was going to be a dolphins fan or something like. I probably I don't know how I happened, but I remember again Dan Marino Jersey and I was dolphins fan. That's awesome. Yeah, and Dan's an ambassador for us. Awesome and well, Jeff, I appreciate you coming on and could you let the listeners know where to find metaphans? Absolutely so, if you go to www dot metascom, that will be the site where you can go and mint a Metaphan, but also near that mint button, which is gonna be on the top right of the screen, you also see the joint discord button. If you have never minted something before, or if you've never opened up a wallet or you've never even liked purchase CRYPTO, whatever it may be, we get it. We, like I mentioned earlier in the podcast, we have a ton of people that have been in those shoes before. Jump into the discord. If it takes you the two minutes to sign up and create a profile, I seriously highly encourage you to do it. It's just so you can kind of talk to some of our people and they will answer all of your questions. All be around there and we can help you kind of navigate through that process of what opening up a wallet is and how you fund it and how you mint a Metaphan. So we'll be there for you every step of the way and looking forward to hopefully welcoming some of you guys to the Metaphan as we call it, and being part of some of our in real life experiences in perks and access as we keep trucking along.

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